Author Topic: Nation's #1 player  (Read 4224 times)

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Offline LynchMob42

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Nation's #1 player
« on: January 11, 2009, 07:56:54 PM »
Bryce Brown was in Manhattan over the weekend. It looks like he's down to KSU, Miami (where his brother is currently), and Oregon (where close friend Chris Harper is currently).

There have been rumblings about both Harper and A. Brown being unhappy in their current situations. Even more rumors have flown about Harper possibly transferring to K-State.

Offline mpalmer4

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Re: Nation's #1 player
« Reply #1 on: January 11, 2009, 08:25:09 PM »
I definitely can't blame Arthur Brown for not wanting to play for Shannon.

Also, Rivals has Rueben Randle as #1 player, not Brown.

Offline LynchMob42

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Re: Nation's #1 player
« Reply #2 on: January 11, 2009, 09:46:43 PM »
Also, Rivals has Rueben Randle as #1 player, not Brown.

For now...

Offline mpalmer4

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Re: Nation's #1 player
« Reply #3 on: January 11, 2009, 11:54:09 PM »
For now...

Well, it just changed last month so, who knows?

Offline Cynical Puppet

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Re: Nation's #1 player
« Reply #4 on: January 12, 2009, 12:23:28 AM »
It won't change to dramatically from here on out. All the AA games are over and all the seasons are over.

Offline Hsker4Life

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Re: Nation's #1 player
« Reply #5 on: January 12, 2009, 10:12:12 AM »
I would stay far away from both Browns.

Amazing athletes, but they have TROUBLE written all over them. 

Offline LynchMob42

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Re: Nation's #1 player
« Reply #6 on: January 13, 2009, 06:32:03 PM »
I definitely can't blame Arthur Brown for not wanting to play for Shannon.

Also, Rivals has Rueben Randle as #1 player, not Brown.

For now...

The new Rivals 100 is out. http://rivals100.rivals.com/viewrank.asp?ra_key=1936

1. Bryce Brown, RB, Wichita East

Offline mpalmer4

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Re: Nation's #1 player
« Reply #7 on: January 13, 2009, 08:46:26 PM »
I just saw that too.  I doubt he goes to KSU, and even if he does, I really don't care.  One RB can't make a team, especially without an OL.

Offline Scarecrow

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Re: Nation's #1 player
« Reply #8 on: January 14, 2009, 03:01:09 PM »
Unless you're Barry Sanders. Hmmm...

Offline mpalmer4

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Re: Nation's #1 player
« Reply #9 on: January 14, 2009, 04:44:30 PM »
Unless you're Barry Sanders. Hmmm...

They still weren't  great...and they had Thurman Thomas to boot.

Offline architechguy

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Re: Nation's #1 player
« Reply #10 on: January 18, 2009, 11:13:00 PM »
The new Rivals 100 is out. http://rivals100.rivals.com/viewrank.asp?ra_key=1936

Nine out of ten players on this list will be a bust.  Mark it down.

Offline Scarecrow

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Re: Nation's #1 player
« Reply #11 on: January 19, 2009, 02:53:16 PM »
Nine out of ten players on this list will be a bust.  Mark it down.

I think the trend is that only 3 to 4 of the players out of ten are a bust.  Probably another 3 get playing time, but nothing outstanding.  And 3-4 are All-conference.

It's hard not to get too caught up on the stars, but how many times have we seen a 3* out perform a 5*.  Some kids just mature and develop later than 16 y/o (when the stars are first given).

Offline architechguy

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Re: Nation's #1 player
« Reply #12 on: January 19, 2009, 03:36:06 PM »
I think the trend is that only 3 to 4 of the players out of ten are a bust.  Probably another 3 get playing time, but nothing outstanding.  And 3-4 are All-conference.

It's hard not to get too caught up on the stars, but how many times have we seen a 3* out perform a 5*.  Some kids just mature and develop later than 16 y/o (when the stars are first given).
Here's the Top 20 in the state of Texas from 2004, I count 4 out of the top 20 that lived up to expectations.  Some others were solid contributors or flamed out for reasons that weren't their fault (ie, Bobby Reid).  So instead of 9 out of 10 being a bust, only 8 out of 10 will bust.  So if your team gets 10 of these guys in the top 100, try to guess which two of them are going to work out and which 8 are going to bust.

A lot of these kids can't handle NOT being the big man on campus.  They can only make big plays if you give them the ball 30 times a game and they'll strike one big.  College and pro teams can't dedicate that many touches to one player (though some try).  Some guys can't handle the adversity, can't handle the scrutiny or the bright lights.  You can't load up your signing class with all 5 stars recruits, it's the 2 and 3 stars that hold the 4's and 5's together.

http://www.mysanantonio.com/sports/big_12/Football_recruiting_Class_of_2004_hits_and_misses.html

1. Adrian Peterson, RB, Palestine, Oklahoma: Met all expectations as the nation’s top overall prospect.

2. Rhett Bomar, QB, Grand Prairie, Oklahoma: One of the biggest busts in recent recruiting history.

3. Frank Okam, DT, Richardson, Texas: Leveled off a bit but largely excellent in three starting seasons.

4. William Morrisey, DT, Silsbee, Texas A&M: Serious leg injury ended his career after only two seasons.

5. Andrew Kelson, DB, Houston, Texas: Solid contributor struggled to find a permanent position.

6. Bobby Reid, QB, Galena Park, Oklahoma State: Best known for his indirect involvement in Mike Gundy’s “I’m a man” rant.

7. Chris Smith, DE, Allen, Texas A&M: Made six tackles in two seasons before vanishing.

8. George Walker, WR, Houston, Texas: Caught a grand total of one pass for 22 yards.

9. Marcus Walker, DB, Waco, Oklahoma: Solid, if injury-prone; started 25 of his final 29 games.

10. Lance Leggett, WR, Arlington, Miami: Tantalized often, but rarely capitalized on immense physical gifts.

11. Stephen McGee, QB, Burnet, Texas A&M: Respectable career ended with an injury-plagued fizzle.

12. Cedric Dockery, OL, Garland, Texas: Honorable mention All-Big 12 in his final two seasons.

13. McCollins Umeh, DE, Klein, Arizona: Died during a voluntary workout before his freshman year.

14. Jordan Shipley, WR, Burnet, Texas: Shook off the injury bug to enjoy a breakout “senior” campaign.

15. Ryan Young, OL, Waco, Arkansas: Disappeared after failing to qualify academically.

16. Kirby Freeman, QB, Brownwood, Miami: Just completed an undistinguished career as a backup at Baylor.

17. Bobby Tatum, DB, Fort Worth, Texas: Spent two seasons in Austin before transferring to Abilene Christian.

18. Walter Thomas, DT, Galveston, Oklahoma State: Flunked out at OSU, arrested in junior college, cut after 12 minutes as an NFL free agent.

19. Tremaine Johnson, DE, Galena Park, LSU: A serviceable backup who started only two games in four seasons.

20. Chris Ogbonnaya, WR, Houston, Texas: Eventually discovered his niche as a pass-catching running back.

Offline Wildcat Fan

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Re: Nation's #1 player
« Reply #13 on: January 20, 2009, 02:25:07 PM »
It's hard not to get too caught up on the stars, but how many times have we seen a 3* out perform a 5*.  Some kids just mature and develop later than 16 y/o (when the stars are first given).

That's for sure.  If I remember correctly, Darren Sproles was a 2* recruit.  He didn't do too bad...

Offline Scarecrow

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Re: Nation's #1 player
« Reply #14 on: January 20, 2009, 04:11:58 PM »
I went through the rivals top 10-20's to come up with my numbers.  Maybe it's the recruits from Texas that don't pan out as much.  I just think it was a bad year that year.

Also, I would put Cedric Dockery in bold even though it was honorable mention.  That would make 5 out of 20.

Another reason some recruits are highly rated is because their HS coach has the "inroads" with the recruiting experts.  He can campaign for his kids.  Meanwhile, you get a kid from a school that gets little recognition on a yearly basis and he goes to college and outshines the 4-5* recruits.  I like using Joe Ganz 2* as an example who was even turned down by Western Michigan for a scholarship and beat out several 4* QB's on his way to a starting position despite everything working against him (Callahan's promise to Keller's dad).

How did Sproles only end up with 2*'s?  Is it because some recruiting "expert" felt he was too small for Div. IA football?

Offline LynchMob42

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Re: Nation's #1 player
« Reply #15 on: January 20, 2009, 06:18:27 PM »
I think too much credit is given to where a player is from and where he is going.

You're from Texas? That's worth an extra star.
You're going to USC? Two extra stars for you!

I comes down to coaches to evaluate talent and develop it.
I can also think of a lot of local kids, as I'm sure Nebraska fans can, who overachieved, perhaps because of their motivation. Darren Sproles, Terence Newman, Mark Simoneau, Jordy Nelson... These were all in-state kids who were not highly recruited, who worked hard and became nationally honored athletes.

Offline mpalmer4

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Re: Nation's #1 player
« Reply #16 on: January 20, 2009, 07:06:12 PM »
I think too much credit is given to where a player is from and where he is going.

You're from Texas? That's worth an extra star.
You're going to USC? Two extra stars for you!

I comes down to coaches to evaluate talent and develop it.
I can also think of a lot of local kids, as I'm sure Nebraska fans can, who overachieved, perhaps because of their motivation. Darren Sproles, Terence Newman, Mark Simoneau, Jordy Nelson... These were all in-state kids who were not highly recruited, who worked hard and became nationally honored athletes.

Also, instead of looking at stars, I like to look at what offers and visits that a prospect takes.  If a kid is rated a 2-star by Rivals, but has offers from USC, Florida, Oklahoma, Texas, Alabama, etc then I would likely think he is probably a "higher ranked" recruit than that.

Offline LynchMob42

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Re: Nation's #1 player
« Reply #17 on: January 20, 2009, 08:09:24 PM »
Good luck finding one. If he has those offers, his rating will go up.

Offline Scarecrow

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Re: Nation's #1 player
« Reply #18 on: January 20, 2009, 08:15:17 PM »
I think just as much could be said on the flip side.  If a kid is a 4* this late and only has offers from Nevada, Wyoming, etc.  Then what are we missing.   I hear stories of recruits saying they had offers from schools when they really haven't just to boost their ratings.

Last year, we saw the recruit that actually signed with Cal, but he never ever received an offer.  It was all staged.  But this kid knew if he played it, he would get rated higher.

Offline LynchMob42

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Re: Nation's #1 player
« Reply #19 on: January 20, 2009, 11:57:56 PM »
I think just as much could be said on the flip side.  If a kid is a 4* this late and only has offers from Nevada, Wyoming, etc. 

Can you find any?

I also know for a fact that Rivals down-grades qualifying risks. I don't think they should, as it doesn't diminish the players abilities.

Offline Scarecrow

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Re: Nation's #1 player
« Reply #20 on: January 21, 2009, 02:35:11 PM »
Can you find any?

I also know for a fact that Rivals down-grades qualifying risks. I don't think they should, as it doesn't diminish the players abilities.

Maybe it was players who were qualifying risks that I noticed.

You won't find uncommitted 4* prospects with no major schools offering this late in the game, unless they are already committed to a school before the USC's and Ohio State's had a chance to offer (where stars matter).

I was actually thinking of Nuckols (Colorado commit) where he only had offers from Minnesota, Arizona, and Arizona St.    He had interest in Florida, Oregon, USC, and Washington, but none of them offered.  He was in Rivals preseason top 100.  Now he is just the #23 DT.  Was his senior season not that impressive or was it because he never received offers from schools that usually finish top 20 in recruiting.

Offline SoonerNation#1

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Re: Nation's #1 player
« Reply #21 on: January 22, 2009, 12:42:55 PM »
+1 on Sproles. Quentin Griffin was also an unknown 2*.

Offline Scarecrow

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Re: Nation's #1 player
« Reply #22 on: February 04, 2009, 07:37:38 PM »
according to this article:
http://www.sun-sentinel.com/sports/highschool/recruiting/sfl-flspwebsite03sbfeb03,0,1182329.story

The recruiting sites get the same information as everyone else posted on Bryce Brown's recruiting handler's website (Brown isn't being paid).  Rivals and Scout have to pay since the Brown's aren't taking any interviews.

I like this idea.  It keeps the pressure off the kids and lets them post the information when they are ready to share it.

The information being released to Rivals and Scout are given by the coaches.  I know the NU coaches aren't fans of the recruiting sites.

According to his website:
http://www.potentialplayers.com/player_detail.aspx?id=2

Bryce Brown has about 27 schools listed.  I'm sure it will be awhile before he decides.

Offline LynchMob42

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Re: Nation's #1 player
« Reply #23 on: February 04, 2009, 08:20:37 PM »
Brown is still committed to Miami and is still considering Oregon and Kansas State. My guess would be:

Miami - 50%
Oregon - 40 %
Kansas State - 10%

Offline mpalmer4

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Re: Nation's #1 player
« Reply #24 on: February 04, 2009, 10:26:04 PM »
Brown is still committed to Miami and is still considering Oregon and Kansas State. My guess would be:

Miami - 50%
Oregon - 40 %
Kansas State - 10%

 ;)